Curt Shackelford: the man, the hero, the WaPo legend. For the past six years, Curt has been producing live stand-up comedy shows all over the D.C. metro area through his company, "Stand-Up Comedy to Go". And when I say producing, I am not talking about finding some dive bar w/a PA system so you can bring your dumbass friends, dress in a suit, and splash PBR in their faces. No, instead Curt brings a serious business approach to his comedy ventures. Anyone who has seen Curt pull up in his patented yellow truck knows exactly what I mean.
For inside it, Curt has everything he needs to put on a comedy show. Mic stand and mic? Check. Stage? Check. Fake brick wall? Check. 200 pens? Check. Just give Curt the go ahead and he will put up a show, like some sort of "big top" ringmaster.
These shows have been the launching pad for many local comics. Some have jumped to bigger and better places for comedy. Others are just thankful for the opprotunity to have consistent shows at which to perform. Either way, Curt has been an instrumental force in helping young comedians find their voice in D.C. for many years.
Curt has found his niche, and because of that, he won't budge on how he feels a comedy show should be run, and has no problem telling you that in almost every way possible. From the novella-sized attachment he emails to comics; to his grade school–like roll calls; to the "Everyone's a Comedian" audience-prying conclusion to his shows; you know it is Curt's three-ring circus, and he will run it as he pleases. Even if the clowns get upset.
And there have been many upset clowns over the years. Each one having their own reasons for why particpation under Curt's tent is not worth the price of admission. You may have heard some of them already. You may have not. But, this is not a post about them.
This is a rare interview with Mr. Shackelford. A no-holds barred event where Curt has the opprotunity to answer some of D.C.'s biggest questions as well as give his take on how the D.C. scene has changed, and how he views the world of comedy. Grab your popcorn, folks, you are in for a spectacle!
[Ladies and gentleman, boys and girls, children of all ages.....hit the jump.]
For the unfortunate minority who have never heard of you or what you have done in D.C. over the years, please introduce yourself.
Hello, my name is Curt Shackelford….and I’m a compulsive organizer.
I started my first open mic at Parkers in Bethesda 5 or 6 years ago after tiring of schlepping to Wiseacres from Bethesda to compete with 20 other comics for 12 slots. I wanted my own show that I could MC, guaranteeing stage time each week. I found a local Bethesda bar that was game, and proceeded to run the absolute worst open mic ever—made many mistakes but really learned to run a room. The show ultimately sank for many reasons. The primary reason being that it was on a Monday night. Only alcoholic single people go out on Mondays.
Ironically the new Friday show at Parkers will prolly be a huge success cuz it’s on a great night—
What rooms do you currently run ?
Ri Ra Irish Pub in Clarendon, VA; Wed nite open mic
Topaz Hotel in Dupont Circle, DC; Thurs nite open mic
Hyatt Hotel in Bethesda, MD; Saturday nite showcase
What is your comedic background?
I did stand up for a couple years then started running my own shows to guarentee myself stage time cuz there was only one open mic back then—Wiseacres. Quite by accident, I discovered I was the greatest comedy show producer that ever lived.
Who are some of your influences comedic or otherwise?
Martin Short, Todd Glass, Brian Regan, etc.—goofy/silly comics—Will Ferrell—are some of my faves.
What's hacky comedy to you?
Not so much material-wise cuz that’s obvious—everyone agrees what is hacky—but what really annoys me is the hacky lines that comics feel they need to say:
“Keep it going for…..”
“Are you guys having fun?”
“How you guys doin tonite?”
“Who’s drinkin tonite?”
...and a dozen others that only annoy the audience and eat up the clock.
You give us your reasoning for producing shows over performing, but why do it at all? What drives you to be involved in comedy?
I went to the Ticonderoga Pencil Factory when i was a kid—the sight of all these yellow pencils rolling out on the assembly line was mesmerizing, cranking out perfect pencils by the hundreds every minute—they had to pull me away from the viewing glass. Aspergers again?—a fondness for systems, uniformity, and patterns...
Anyhoo, there's something satisfying about cranking out a fine product every week, whether it's a pencil or a show; in that respect, it's "fun."
What do you look for in a space when you approach a venue?
Separate room away from the main room is the big thing. My big mistake with Parkers was it’s a big open space. I naïvely thought that everyone in the place would be enthralled and thrilled to hear great comedy for free. Nope. Some people would rather not hear comedy—even great comedy. They’re on a date or they’re with a friend they haven’t seen for a while, and wanna chat, etc. So you need that separate room so these folks can have a place to go to get away from the show. At Parkers, it was seen as an intrusion by some folks…like “Hey…I’m eatin' here!!”
Let's just get to it, shall we? Recently, you wrote to me that you "[are] responsible for the renaissance of the DC open mic scene...five years ago there was only one open mic at Wiseacres...I copied them and made some improvements on their system...then people copied me, made some improvements on my system, and it snowballed from there."
I have to qualify that by saying Chris White’s starting of DC Standup was what made the renaissance possible. That site was like erecting a giant canvas, and suddenly everyone started throwing paint on it. I started Parkers, and I think other comics saw how easy it was to open a room of their own, so they followed suit in their respective neighborhoods. My shows were way better cuz I brought “real show” production values (stage, spotlight, etc.) to the venue. I wanted to copy that aspect of Wiseacres as well even though Parkers was just a bar.
Maybe you answered this already but you have also said that "open mics that are run by comics instead of non-coms like me will eventually & inevitably fail." Well Curt, you are actually right, because ALL open mics eventually fail/close.
So why then do you feel rooms run by non-coms are better?
If a comic splits his energy between practicing/perfecting his craft and running a room (read “selling food and beverages to justify your show's existence”), his craft will suffer. Every minute a comic spends on running a show is a minute he could have spent writing, rehearsing, or performing. This will eventually annoy the comic to the point he/she gives up in disgust, and turns his focus solely to his craft.
I tried to perform and run at Parkers, and I did both of them perfectly half-assed cuz it’s too taxing to do both well. I gave up in disgust but chose running shows over performing cuz I was great at it. I was a good comic, but a great producer. You gotta be great at what you do or forget it. Good is not good enough.
Then, please explain the success of an open mic like "Soho Coffee & Tea", which from what DC Standup has said was the longest-running DC open mic of all time (and that website is never wrong), and also happened to be run by a comic.
Soho—Paul Schorsch shut his show down fed up and disgusted. He wrote a blog about it called “Curt is right—I’m fed up and disgusted.”
What do you look for in comics when you book Topaz? How about the Hyatt?
Silliness, silliness, silliness.
You have expressed some strong feelings about new comics, in which you have said, "more stage time will *not* make you funnier. You are funny right out of the gate or not...and all the stage time in the world will not help you cuz 99.9% of what makes you funny is *beyond your control*".
This statement is gonna get me assassinated, but I firmly believe this.
Just one example:
Andy Haynes—it’s not his writing, his delivery, his whatever—it’s his default facial expression that has to do with genetics that makes everything he does/says “funny.”
Many more examples upon request.
You have also expressed to me your usual hesitation for putting up improvisers having a go at stand-up.
Not at all—I actually love improv comics who come into standup—they are usually stronger comics because of their improv background (yourself, Scovel, etc.)
It’s the actual art of improv that I find tedious beyond belief; it's like waiting for lightning to strike—too hit or miss. With standup, you just have more chance of regular laughs via punchlines.
As a former comic yourself Curt, what is your reasoning on the harsh approach you take with booking really funny, established comedians who have proven themselves time and time again vs. the notion that "newbies and their audience" dictate the success of a locally run comedy show?
When I ran Parkers five years ago I used nothing but the best comics—I promoted the hell out of the show, but we never got a decent size audience with any regularity. Newbies were not gonna get on my “quality” show cuz I didn’t wanna dilute it.
The show eventually died cuz we couldn’t bring in enough bodies—even though I did a solid year with nothing but the best comics. Ironically, the show would have *eventually* caught on and it would have been packed, but the word “eventually” does not sit well with venue owners. They no understanding of “eventually.” They only understand “within this quarter.”
Now my shows are a mix of newbies who bring the audience and veterans who make them laugh.
Every time I try to tamper with the mix, the show sucks.
Great lineup of too many veteran comics equals playing to six people.
Shitty lineup of too many newbies equals playing to a packed house of folks that will never come again.
So it’s a mixed bag—a combined approach. As the Devil Himself (manifested as Dick Cheney) said, "sometimes the answer is 'both'."
You have butted heads with many comics during your time of booking shows. Some have voiced their opinion, others have not. What are your feelings about Jay Hastings and the dispute that erupted between you two last year?
Art versus commerce—Jay is a comic who naturally champions art over commerce. I am a greedy producer who favors commerce over art. I try to keep a balance though; but commerce comes first.
“You can’t have a cupboard if there ain’t no wall.”
Comedy is supposed to be fun. When comics first receive your pre-show list of rules, they tend to think "holy shit, what have i gotten myself into." So my question is, why not get rid of them? Especially since some parts, like the dress code (no Timbalands, no doo rags, no black skin) seem to be targeting a certain group.
There were no rules when I started. Everytime I got reprimanded by the venue, I made it a rule to prevent it from happening again.
The rules are there to "set the tone," and the tone is, "This is not just another shitty open mic with seven TV's on and three drunk guys who don't even realize there's a show going on."
I want comics to treat it like a *real show*. I certainly do, and they should too. The 345 rules say that loud & clear.
Thankfully, there are 15 other shows in town where you can get stage time—but they aren't as good as mine, precisely cuz they lack "structure" (another word for rules). I don't want to make it seem like the Big Bad Venue made me institute that dress code; that was all my doing.
My shows are in white neighborhoods. White folks are frightened by the gangsta look—white-black-Latino-whatever; it's intended to look threatening and it works. "Threatening" is not a good vibe at a comedy show.
Ironically, I lifted the dress code language verbatim from a flyer put out by FUR nightclub, a black club, that read "no Tims, no skullies, etc."
My one black friend (I have pictures of me shaking his hand) had to explain to me what that stuff was, but I knew if the black clubs themselves didn't want that in their venues then I didn't either.
Some people in the community feel like you avoid comics who run their own rooms. Any comment?
This is true, but not for sinister reasons. They have their own rooms so they no longer are as “needy” as other comics. They have a guaranteed weekly slot; so I prefer to use comics who are more in need of stage time cuz they [don’t have] their own rooms.
Do you think there is ANY correlation between the success of Rory Scovel, Ryan Conner, and Danny Rouhier, and the constant rotation you kept those three comics in at all of your shows? Are you trying to do the same for comics presently? If so, throw out some names. Go ahead, who does Curt like nowadays?
We fed off each other. It was a perfectly symbiotic relationship—very win-win.
I think I speeded up their ascent to the NYC level by providing them with enough bodies in the audience (non-com bodies) every week so they could get real feedback on their performances, tweak them in time for next week’s show, etc.
My current fave—Hampton. Again it’s the way he looks, walks, stands, sounds, his mannerisms—all stuff beyond his control.
And he was blessed with the silliness gene—again something beyond his control.
Why don't you like watching basketball games?
Sneakers suction-cup “thwick-thwick-thwick” sound of running down the court plus the squeaking from the sudden stops, turns, and starts. I have mild Asperger's Syndrome that makes me sensitive to certain sounds.
Solution: Moccasins.
Why the hell don't you ever come out to other shows? I know you are a busy guy, but how can you expect to be on the pulse of the comedy scene in town without seeing it?
I would love to come watch other shows cuz I can’t really enjoy my own shows cuz I’m “working” and can never fully focus on enjoying a comic’s set. But I’m just too wiped out at the end of the day. I’m asleep by 8pm and up by 4am the next day to go pore over the topographical map of the DC Open Mic scene in my bunker’s war room in my poofy Field Marshall pants…pushing little plastic tanks around with one of those plastic tank pusher stick–thingies.
What is with the email blasts, really? Why ignore so many emails? Don't you think that it is mean and it undermines people's confidence?
I’m running my shows in the cracks and crevices of my day job. I gotta cram all my comedy work into very limited time; efficiency rules the day. If I had someone to do the booking, it would be great. They could take the time to be a bit more human about the whole booking process, but until I can afford to hire someone it will have to be mass email cattle-call style.
Aparna does a swell job running the lights at your shows, doesn't she? Quite the gal.
I picked her cuz she’s small, and can fit in the tiny crevices I reserve for the light lady—not taking up any unnecessary square footage that the audience could use.
Swell job?
She routinely falls asleep, talks during the show, gives more time to her friend-comics, but thinks I don’t notice cuz I am old and senile. But until a smaller comic comes along, her job is safe. I don’t like young people.
How do you see the open mic scene changing five years from now, and what are you doing to make sure you are a part of it?
There are shitty cover bands playing live “music” on every street corner. I’d like to see a comedy night on every corner alongside this plethora of live music. It should be as prevalent as live music. But live comedy is seen as a “wild animal” and also a “black sheep of the arts,” so venues are very afraid of letting this wild rabid dog into their fine establishment. But they have no problem letting in a lame cover band—safer I guess.
But the more rooms there are, the easier it will be for the next room to open, cuz you can point to the other rooms and say “Hey look Mr. General Manager, that place across the street is doing comedy!” So then it can snowball even bigger and bigger.
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